On the Podcast: Hot Girl Summer [Rebranded]
In our most recent episode of Out of Session with Kindman & Co., our practice’s podcast, three of our fabulous therapists, Steve, Dani, & Caitlin chatted together about What is Hot Girl Summer?, Megan Thee Stallion, cultural appropriation, their very own remixes/rebrands of Hot Girl Summer. Read on for the transcript or listen to the episode Hot Girl Summer [rebranded] on Apple Podcasts.
Steve Wilson (00:00):
Hello, my name is Steve. (He/him)
Caitlin Harrison (00:03):
My name is Caitlin. (She/her)
Dani Marrufo (00:05):
and my name is Dani (She/her).
Steve Wilson (00:07):
And we are Out of Session with Kindman & Co., A Feelings Forward Podcast where we leave our therapist selves at the door and have messy real conversations about being human. Today's topic is Hot Girl Summer. Woohoo. Whoop, whoop. We're gonna talk a little bit about why we wanted to take on this topic and, and why this was appealing. Get into a little bit of the history about Hot Girl Summer, who coined the term and what it has become and how it has become what it is today. So looking forward to hearing what my colleagues have to say about this. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and the research that they've done into it. And also excited to have a little fun mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and explore new ways of thinking about this idea of hot girl summer. But before we get into the meat of our discussion, I wanted to, in the spirit of summertime and having some fun and making this not so serious all the time play a little game with you both.
Ooh. Love a good game. And the title of this game is Swipe Right. Swipe Left. Familiar? Take taking this from the dating app world, where to swipe left means you don't like it. And to swipe right is you do mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. and I'm curious to hear your hot takes on these, what I think are summer topics, <laugh>. And so let me know, swipe right, or swipe left on these things that I've come up with and, and a little bit about why you chose this idea. Okay. First one is swipe right, swipe left body, bikini body
Caitlin & Dani (01:54):
Swipe left, left, left, left. Swipe Left. Tell me all <laugh>, <laugh> all the way left.
Caitlin Harrison (02:00):
[00:02:00] Yes. I don't know how much we need to share, but Yeah. Fuck that. Mm-Hmm. Mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. and everybody is a body and bodies don't have to be contained. I don't, yeah. Yeah.
Dani Marrufo:
You just instantly lost it. I was like, bikini, and I'm like, no. Left, left <laugh>.
Steve Wilson (02:15):
Left, left before you're done. I agree. I think swipe right on. You already have a bikini beach body because Whoa. I thought you were about to get really, like, I was like, wow. Controversial.
Hot take. No, everybody is a bikini body. Everybody's a beach body. So swipe right on your body as it is. Mm-Hmm. It's beautiful and great.
Caitlin Harrison (02:36):
Also, just quick rant. It is not brave to wear a bikini. Okay. Agreed. It's not brave. Like, I hate that. I hate the comments of like, oh, well you're so brave to be on the beach. No, you're not. No. You're actually mean to think that. Okay. Yeah.
Steve Wilson (02:51):
Agreed. Okay. Okay. That's quite left on all that. Another controversial summertime thing. Wildfires.
Caitlin Harrison (02:59):
Oh, <laugh> you laugh.
Steve Wilson (03:06):
They're laughing, out of discomfort. I guess <laugh> Climate change edition. Yeah.
Caitlin Harrison (03:17):
Like, okay. Swipe left, obviously on people getting hurt. Yeah. And our, and our wildness burning swipe right on. Like, climate change is real and we need to be [00:03:30] doing something about it. Yes. thoughts?
Dani Marrufo (03:34):
<Laugh>. I mean again, that one was pretty straightforward for me. <Laugh> Nothing much to say there.
Steve Wilson (03:43):
I feel you. I feel you. I same swipe left on their terrible disasters and happening more often. Also, swipe right on understanding that it's a part of California ecology happens somewhat regularly, but the scale has changed. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> in recent years [00:04:00] due to impacts. Okay. Let me lighten it up a little bit. Outdoor dining, <laugh>,
Caitlin Harrison (04:06):
<Laugh>, outdoor dining. I mean, Dani, take it away. <Laugh>.
Dani Marrufo (04:11):
I'm gonna say Right? Because you know, we're talking about summer. We're talking about being out with the friends and just being on like a nice maybe like misted. Yes. Patio. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. That sounds great. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, I would swipe left on like outdoor dining. There's like flies. I'm sweating. [00:04:30] Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> food is just horrible. That's a no. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But you know, that magical kind of Yes. Golden hour. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> dinner with friends. That sounds great.
Caitlin Harrison (04:40):
Yeah. Yeah. Swipe right. Outdoor dining when it is 75 and lower. And like, and
Steve Wilson:
Also a lot of, we have conditions. A lot of conditions. Yes. Uhhuh. And it's, if there are mosquitoes like Swipe Left. Yeah. I am one of those girls that's just like, oh, they love me. Mosquitoes do love me. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So swipe left on Mosquitoes. I'm gonna say generally swipe right on outdoor dining, but left when it's like we have outdoor dining, but it's actually just table set up, like in the parking area with no effort to like Yes. Make it feel comfortable or shield you from traffic.
Caitlin Harrison (05:15):
Yes. Traffic. Yes.
Steve Wilson (05:18):
<Laugh>. I don't wanna have dinner. In rush hour traffic
Caitlin Harrison (05:22):
At the same. Right.
Steve Wilson (05:23):
Okay. How about wearing flip flops everywhere you go.
Dani Marrufo (05:29):
Ooh, no. That's a right. That's wait, right is right. Is left. Left. That's a left.
Steve Wilson (05:35):
Yeah. That's Dani. Dani hasn't been on the apps. <Laugh>. <laugh>. I think I'm also, I think I'm also a left generally 'cause they aren't that comfortable. And I do have my mom's voice in my head of like, don't slap your flip flops. I don't know. Just too much noise or something. They're noisy.
Caitlin Harrison (05:57):
Yeah.
Dani Marrufo (05:57):
Dangerous while driving. Ooh.
Steve Wilson (05:59):
Wow. [00:06:00] I didn't know that Destination.
Dani Marrufo (06:03):
I Had a friend that got like, in an accident because his flip flop like got caught under the, one of the pedals and like, Oh. And it just like, kept going. It Just kept going.
Caitlin Harrison (06:13):
Oh, that's, oh
Dani Marrufo (06:13):
Wait. No, no, no. Didn't keep going. You couldn't put it Down. He couldn't break. Oh. So It's probably the break, you know, That makes Sense. Both bad outcomes.
Steve Wilson (06:20):
Yeah. well I didn't know about that <laugh> previously. I was like all the way. Right. All the time. Growing up in like a beach town. That's all you wore. [00:06:30] You got the flip flop tan. It was kind of like a mark of like pride. Like, I've been outside all summer.
Caitlin Harrison (06:35):
You were a rainbow boy, weren't you? Yes. Yeah.
Steve Wilson (06:37):
Very much so.
Dani Marrufo (06:39):
Sperry. Huh? Sperry's.
Steve Wilson (06:45):
That is, was that like, be wonderful? No, like we wanted a close toe beach shoe. No such thing.
Caitlin Harrison (06:49):
Okay. Birkenstocks. <Laugh>
Steve Wilson (06:51):
Birks Birks are fine. Okay. I'm into Birks. Okay. I'm into sandals, not flip flops. Sure. We live in a city now. Yes. So it's kind of gross.
Caitlin Harrison (06:56):
We? Well I've never lived in the beach. <Laugh>.
Steve Wilson (07:00):
[00:07:00] Okay. I live in the city Now.
Caitlin Harrison (07:02):
We look like siblings, but <laugh>
Steve Wilson (07:06):
Not gonna have my feet out all the time. Getting gross. Okay. How about going to the movies just for air conditioning.
Caitlin Harrison (07:15):
Oh, swipe right. Love movies. Well, I'll go for To the movies. For the movies. And then I also enjoy air conditioning.
Dani Marrufo (07:22):
Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Yes. Solid, right? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>
Steve Wilson (07:25):
All away. Right. I agree. Love the movies. If there's nothing good coming out, I will use [00:07:30] my like AMC stubs thing just to like sit in the cool dark room. Yeah. When it's 105 degrees outside.
Dani Marrufo (07:36):
Totally. Are you a bring your own snacks kind of person?
Caitlin Harrison (07:38):
Ooh, swipe right. Swipe Right. Swipe right on Bringing your own snacks. I'm bringing snacks and alcohol! Do not tell AMC, they'll take away my stubs pass. <Laugh>.
Steve Wilson (07:52):
Do not tell them.
Caitlin Harrison (07:53):
I have a cooler that looks like a purse. It's perfect. Ah. Okay. I'm bringing canned cocktails. I, I have brought [00:08:00] ingredients to make cocktail <laugh>.
Steve Wilson (08:03):
Oh, I'm going to the movies with you. Yeah, this sounds great. Okay. I usually just wear baggy pants with like deep pockets. Oh yeah. So I can fit a full size Red Vines box. Yes. Like in my pocket. Perfect. Nice pockets. I just can't
Caitlin Harrison (08:15):
Yeah. Swipe right on Men's pocket. <Laugh>
Steve Wilson (08:17):
<Laugh>. We love them. We love them. This one's near and dear to my heart. Swipe right. Swipe left. The Sriracha shortage. [collective Breath]
Caitlin Harrison (08:27):
Ooh. I mean, <laugh>,
Dani Marrufo (08:30):
[00:08:30] I think I just got tearful <laugh> thinking of, you know, I've been having recent tummy issues. I just miss Sriracha generally, you know, I can't, I just can't do it.
Caitlin Harrison (08:42):
Could you imagine if you came out of your tummy troubles and there was no more Sriracha?
Dani Marrufo (08:47):
I mean tearful. <Laugh>.
Caitlin Harrison (08:50):
Yeah. I, well, okay. A famously Caucasian tongue over here. I'm going to Swipe left. Like, I have sympathy for everybody, [00:09:00] but I don't use it so personally, I don't care. I understand, but well, Personally, I don't care. It got very quiet!
Steve Wilson (09:12):
Wow. Caitlin. Okay. Swipe left on that!
Caitlin Harrison (09:15):
I care about the culture of Sriracha and I know it's like a small business and they like the way that they've marketed is really cool and that they haven't, it's all been word of mouth. So like I care about the story. Yeah.
Steve Wilson (09:28):
It's a good story. I hear that it's coming back. [00:09:30] There have been supply chain issues. Anyway. It'll be back. Swipe right on Sriracha, Swipe left on the shortage. 'cause Like, I would douse my food in it. <Laugh>.
Caitlin Harrison (09:40):
I thought you were going to say
Steve Wilson (09:41):
Yourself. I do. I do. When Possible.
Caitlin Harrison (09:42):
“I would douse myself in it.” <Laugh>
Steve Wilson (09:45):
Probably not that. Anyway. Okay. Well, thank you for, thank you for playing. Yeah, thank you. That was our little appetizer. And that was fun. So thank you for your mm-hmm. <Affirmative> for your takes on these [00:10:00] very traditional summer items. Yes. <laugh>. Okay. So let's get into the meat of our podcast. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, the, the actual subject that we're here. Talk about Hot Girl Summer. Dani, you proposed this as a good subject mm-hmm. <Affirmative> for us to talk about. And I'm curious to know why, why it was appealing to you or what was, what was on your mind when you thought about talking about this?
Dani Marrufo (10:28):
Pride season? Mm. Megan, thee Stallion. Being at LA Pride, it was like a coming together of a lot of very light things, but as we've talked about it, I was like, I've just got more and more invested. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So I think it just started out of lightness of like, Ooh, let me like re-listen to these Megan the stallion hits. Right. and I was like, in the summer anthem kind of era, right? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and one of the summer anthems this could [00:11:00] be debatable. I don't know if any of you listen to Bad Bunny at all.
Steve Wilson (11:04):
A little bit.
Caitlin Harrison (11:05):
Sorry. Yeah. I'm not against
Dani Marrufo (11:06):
Bad Bunny's got this song El Apagón, which is just like, it hits a certain part of the song and it's just like party vibes, like club, like laser, like in my mind it's just like clubbing, like laser lights, like, and it's just a great song. And I was like, going with it. And then I was like, well, what I don't speak fluent Spanish. Okay. And I was like, well, what is it actually saying in this? And what I saw and read is that it's actually a very serious song about like, blackouts in Puerto Rico. And I was like, wow, I really need to learn more about these Summer <laugh>
Caitlin Harrison (11:42):
That's fair.
Steve Wilson (11:44):
Not just a good time?!
Dani Marrufo (11:46):
Yeah. Not just a, I was like, the vision in my mind of like clubs and laser lights really turned into something more serious.
Caitlin Harrison (11:54):
<Laugh>. Yeah.
Dani Marrufo (11:55):
So, you know, it's still fun to listen to, but I was like, okay. Then preparing for [00:12:00] Megan thee Stallion and I was like, hot Girl Summer. Like, I was like rewatching the music videos, like trying to see like, what is Hot Girl Summer? Mm. so just something fun that I like to do is like, deep dive on different songs that I like. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, like what is there history there? Is there anything more there? Or is it just like a really fun song? And so I think it was that all coming together.
Caitlin Harrison (12:23):
Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. I love that. That's so, yeah. I had no idea. And yeah, it really, there are so many songs that I have no idea what I'm singing <laugh>. It reminds me like, growing up, like, you know, you're in middle school and like, you don't about sex, or that was just me and then <laugh> and then, and then you're like singing the words, all the songs and you're like, oh wow... You like look back on it. Like, Ooh, that was uncomfortable. And my mom is right there. Yeah. <laugh>.
Dani Marrufo (12:50):
That's funny. I would be like singing songs and my mom would be like, don't sing that. And I'd be like, whyyy? Yeah. And yeah, I remember a specific song and I was like, okay, now I understand why I shouldn't have been singing.
Steve Wilson (12:59):
I never got the [00:13:00] specific, like, don't do this. But I definitely remember the kind of like raised eyebrow that I [laughter] Would get from my Parents and be like, do you know, tell me why you like this song.
Caitlin Harrison (13:10):
Oh, your parents Had Curiosity
Steve Wilson (13:12):
Sure. <Laugh>. So we're gonna call it that <laugh> But I love the idea of like, you know, coming to a new understanding of something that like, was just really fun or like really exciting and like, I like your story, Dani, about like, getting into this like, fun party mm-hmm. <Affirmative> Club Anthem mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and like noticing that there was actually something really thoughtful about it. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And I think a lot of like pop stuff gets a bad rap for being like, unserious or just for fun, which is like, totally appropriate because you get to just have fun, but also they can have something really important to say. A good message.
Caitlin Harrison (13:53):
It was a better segue than you thought to put in wildfires into the summer. Swipe right, swipe left. [00:14:00] We are dealing with a lot of both/ands here. <Laugh>
Steve Wilson (14:04):
Throw and Everywhere Fun. And...
Dani Marrufo (14:06):
I feel like Hot Girl Summer is just something that's said now. And I was like, Why do we say this? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, I don't know, is it from the song? Is it not mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, is there something else? Yeah. So yeah.
Caitlin Harrison (14:17):
Great. So I'll tell you. So please do tell us about it. When you were talking about this and we're, and we were collaborating, we're like, okay, yeah. How do we wanna dive in? So yeah, we wanted to look into some of the research. And so what I found, and I was surprised, so it is Megan Thee Stallion is the one to coin the, and start the Hot Girl Summer Trend. Verified. It's verified. And it was in her, I, I believe it wasn't even in a song, it was her album, Fever, that came out in 2019. And the album's Cover Art has the Line, "she's the hot girl and she's bringing the heat." And so it was actually more of like a marketing thing and she like became to embody and she changed her Twitter name to Hot Girl Meg. So then Hot Girl Summer just like went off and she tweeted because people were like, what is Hot Girl Summer and her Twitter on July 17th, 2019 @TheeStallion, she says, "being a hot girl is about being unapologetically you having fun, being confident, living your truth and being the life of the party, et cetera." So, and she went on in an interview with the Root to say she addressed like, it's not gendered. "it Hot Girl Summer is basically just about women and men just being unap, unapologetically them just having a good ass time." So it started and was coined by Megan Thee Stallion and it has become something bigger...maybe better? I don't know.
Steve Wilson (16:00):
I think that's, I I love that it was that she took the time to actually like describe it mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and like what it is and like how, how she sees Hot Girl Summer, like she was like, this is, this is what we're gonna do. It's gonna be about funs, we're not having a good time mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and like just really consciously owning this thing. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. Because I often think about these phrases that we hear and we don't always know where they come from. Like there're terms of phrase or expressions that just feel like they've always been a part of our language, but they, we can't always trace their origin mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. So it's really unusual, I think to have somebody say like, this was Megan Thee Stallion who was like, this is, this is my thing and it's, it's for all of you. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Yeah. And I think that's awesome. I think in looking at a lot of these that type of language, it brings up the the trend of appropriating language and culture from black culture mm-hmm. <Affirmative> from people of color, from from oppressed,
Caitlin Harrison (17:02):
Specifically Black women?
Steve Wilson (17:03):
Specifically black women. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And what it makes me think of is something that comes up a lot in like gay spaces that I'm in and queer spaces is how quickly language gets appropriated from black women into like white, gay male culture and also into the culture at large, which is generally white. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and straight and Cis and all of the things that are very normative. And I think it reminds me of the discussion around when Broad City was on tv mm-hmm. And they were like, "yaas, queen" Yeah. To everything. And it was really fun and everyone was into it, Uhhuh and everyone was saying it Uhhuh, which is fun and like it's really empowering and exciting and all the good things. And also that was an expression that was taken from Black women who have a long tradition of encouraging, helping, supporting and being being there for each other. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And I think it's something that of course is something that we can learn from folks who have traditionally dealt with so much oppression mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, but also to not take their culture from them and use it without giving the people who originated that the credit.
Caitlin Harrison (18:21):
Yes. So, and with that exactly, I was looking at this other article and it was on bet.com and the author, Ezinne Mgbeahuruike I look, tried to look up the pronunciation of her last name and I could not find it on the internet, but I found her Instagram and she looks really cool. So I'm just gonna read this whole quote that I found from the article. So she writes, "black culture and female empowerment as a whole is constantly being exploited by brands and we're sick of it. It's important that we are accredited when brands decide to use our content, lingo, and capitalize off our culture. We should continue to call brands out when they appropriate our culture because they need to see that we have a voice, we have power and agency, we are hashtag hot girls. We are hashtag magic. It's about respect. When you respect the culture, it will be easier, but it, it will be easier. But it's also imperative for brands to be more aware and hire black content creators on their team so they're not facing lawsuits and backlash." And that was from an article titled, We Owe Megan Thee Stallion More Than Money because, and she goes through more and there were so many articles about like how fast it took off, Hot Girl Summer, and because apparently Megan de Stallion, like, or her team didn't brand it or trademark it, everyone was able to use it mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. And so, which is not a slight at them obviously, but it, I think it just took off way faster than they anticipated. And so like even dumb things, like someone tweeted at Wendy's and was like, “I love your Frosted Lemonade”, whatever. And they're like, “it's the Hot Girl Summer drink”.
Like, so it's like, it, I mean, as we all know, like we were there, like, I should have looked at my own Instagram because I am actually positive that I wrote a caption that was like "hot Girl summer." Like, and it was probably like me petting a dog. I don't know. But like, it just, I took off and was very much pervasive and yeah, it brings it back to like, okay, what are we doing when like this pattern keeps happening, why are we still not doing anything about it? Where, you know, there's more awareness, there's more with social media, with articles, and yet, right, like this is still like the problem with, there have not been reparations paid, there is still, America is still built on, has, was, built on black labor of enslaved people mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, and this is pervasive. It's throughout our whole culture. Mm-Hmm.
Steve Wilson (20:57):
<Affirmative>, it reminds me of what Dani you were saying early on, just why you started looking at this and like thinking about pride and pride season and how the corporate involvement in, in that has done is a very similar story to this. Where it's like, this feels like a really, it's really catchy. It's fun mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. and it comes out a place of really genuine, like, creativity and and ownership of like, your own joy. Yes. and at the same time it gets co-opted so quickly because it, it comes from this place of like really incredible integrity and soul that, that connects with so many people. Mm. But you know, with like social media spreads things so quickly mm-hmm. Hashtag hot girl summer, like mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. Yeah. It feels easy. Just like taken on as your own without thinking about it mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and when you see it coming at you from like all these different marketing signals mm-hmm. <Affirmative> similarly like how like Rainbow Corporate Yeah.
Caitlin Harrison (21:58):
Rainbow washing.
Steve Wilson (21:59):
Rainbow washing has been happening every pride month. Yeah. Right. And it feels a little bit like it empties out what the whole thing is really about. Mm-Hmm.
Dani Marrufo (22:07):
Definitely. And I think like the, what you're naming Caitlin is like the quickness of how Hot Girl summer, just like spread is important. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So when Megan tweeted initially like that definition, like the core tenets of Hot Girl Summer, right. Like, there's some really great stuff, stuff in there being unapologetically you having fun, being confident living your truth.
Caitlin Harrison (22:31):
Mm-Hmm.
Dani Marrufo (22:31):
<Affirmative> being the life of the party, et cetera. Right. Like, it's
Caitlin Harrison (22:35):
Just like it cannot be contained. Yeah.
Dani Marrufo (22:37):
It is like, wow, this is amazing. And Danielle Ransom from BET wrote an article that ends in saying Hot Girl summer can mean whatever you want it to mean. Mm. And I think like that was the beginning of it, right? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> where it's very expansive and fun and there's so much that Hot Girl Summer can be. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But like where it went was very interesting. Yeah. And so, like listening to this listening to Megan Thee Stallion's songs later, right? This came in 2019 and just like watching music videos from that album, I was just like, wow, this is still such a summer thing so many years later.
Caitlin Harrison (23:18):
Yes. Yeah. Which I will say, I think time, I mean, she's Megan Thee Stallion is, is here. Right. Forever, hopefully. Like, but so she is a very impactful and inspiring person and voice aaand thinking that this was summer 2019 mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and then we went into pandemic. So I feel like also culturally like we just had to keep holding on to like hot girl summer of just like, maybe we'll be back. We had no idea how good it was. <Laugh> <laugh> like, like all the people are like 2019, you know, they were too late on the trend. They're like, well, 2020 will be my Hot Girl Summer <laugh>. And then I was like, shit, I'm home. Like, so
Steve Wilson (24:01):
Thank you Megan Thee Stallion for giving us something to hold onto
Caitlin Harrison (24:05):
Truly <laugh>
Steve Wilson (24:07):
Sharing the hopes of a hot girl summer. However you interpret that can come true for you Uhhuh. It, it is ongoing. So like, I think to like wrap up this, this part of our, our podcast just Uhhuh, I think what I'm taking from this is how important it is to really track where these ideas are coming from. 'Cause We live in an age of memes and marketing all these things mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and to understand who originated this part of our culture mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. And I think appreciation and appropriation don't have to go Exactly. Hand-In-Hand. Like we can really be like, thank you for, for bringing this to us. Yeah. Megan or mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, other, other Black Femme. Thank you Megan. Thank you.
Caitlin Harrison (24:54):
Thank you Megan. <Laugh>.
Steve Wilson (24:57):
But like, for the folks who really generate that's the, our culture Often mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, black women, people of color mm-hmm. <Affirmative> queer folks that, you know, let's give them the credit that is due. Yeah. And you know, the economic benefit of (Yes.) Of what that creates as well. Yes. so in the spirit of what Megan said it can be how whatever you want it to be, make it yours. We've each come up with some of our own ideas. (I'm So excited, I'm so excited) about how we can reinterpret maybe moving out of that 2020 like, oh my God, Hot Girl Summer. Like what can it be now for you in the future? So I'm curious about some ideas about what it can be.
Caitlin Harrison (25:45):
And I know we have not purposely, we have kept these a secret. We've been brainstorming for weeks. Yep. So I believe we all have a top three, correct? Yes. Okay. So I say we, we go kind of third to first. Great. Okay. Okay. So Dani could you kick us off? <Laugh>? I'm sorry. <Laugh>. You got this.
Dani Marrufo (26:10):
I'm nervous. So my hand is like,
Caitlin Harrison (26:12):
I know
Dani Marrufo (26:13):
I'm, Well. Okay. So going into this, I was just like, okay, funny, serious, like hot girl summer. Should I make that like gender inclusive? Like what direction am I going? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, but I really just stuck with the core of what <laugh> authentically would be me. (Great.) Okay. and so in third place for me is what I call "Come outside and play Summer." Okay. Oh, now this is going all the way back to when I was a kid and like the best thing in summertime, I'm like in the house like cleaning something because I was like always cleaning as a kid. <Laugh>, we'll go into that later. <Laugh> And like you just hear a knock at the door. 'cause You know, we're kids, we don't have phones. Right. Uhhuh, <affirmative>. And then one of my neighborhood friends would show up and be like, "can they come outside and play?" And then I would just like wait and be like, what did my, what did my parents say? Yes or no? And if it was a yes, I would be like running like to the door, just being like, I can come outside and play. Right. But we're adults now. (Uhhuh.)
So ,This is what “Come outside and play Summer” is to you. I love a that story. This is a fantasy also. You go to a friend's house, you knock randomly. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, you don't even say you're coming.
Steve Wilson (27:27):
No call, no warning. You knock
Dani Marrufo (27:29):
Knocking
Caitlin Harrison (27:30):
Anxiety…
Dani Marrufo (27:31):
<Laugh>, you knock. And then you just ask your adult friend, can you come outside and play? And they have to say yes. Oh. Because it's my imagination here uhhuh. So of course they're gonna say yes. Yes. and then I have a fun play date for the both of us. And it could be anything from you know, razor scooters. Oh, finding an ice cream truck. It could be creating an obstacle course. Like this is all free. You know, like this is great. The obstacle course piece. You know, you can use whatever you've got. Yes.
Steve Wilson (28:06):
This is incredible. I love this idea.
Dani Marrufo (28:08):
I don't play marbles. I don't even know how to do that. But that seems like summer. Like we're just Like playing.
Steve Wilson (28:12):
It has summer vibes.
Caitlin Harrison (28:14):
Do People Play Marbles?! <Laugh> also went to the early 1900s. I'm sorry Steve, were you about to say that you did that as a kid?
Steve Wilson (28:21):
No, I was <laugh> your resident old person here. Geriatric 38. I was gonna say, can it be POGS instead of marbles? Did you all play pogs?
Dani Marrufo (28:33):
What's a pog? Are those?
Steve Wilson (28:34):
No. Okay. Well, another podcast, <laugh> pogs, listeners.
Caitlin Harrison (28:41):
Listeners. Lend me your ear. Lemme tell you about pogs,
Steve Wilson (28:43):
Lemme tell you about pogs. It was all the rage.
Dani Marrufo (28:45):
So that's my third choice. Thank you for listening.
Caitlin Harrison (28:48):
That's a good one. I love that. I love the backstory. I love the invitation. I love the demands. <Laugh>. okay. My third place, "Gabagool Summer" <laugh>.
(29:00):
And so in giving credit where credit's due, first time I saw a tweet was like similar to this May 15th, 2022 was her name is "no BS therapist" on Instagram. Her name's Jacqueline, a therapist in New Jersey. She said “instead of a hot girl summer, I'm having a Tony Soprano Summer where I eat Mortdella and Pasta, where I wear my robe all day and go to therapy.” <Laugh>. Okay. Famously I haven't watched The Sopranos, so I know that's probably a multi-layered reference. But in my mind, Gabahoul Summer also we're spelling Gabaghoul differently. Okay. So it's G A B a g H o u L, GABA ghoul. Like spooky. So I'm eating deli meats. I'm outside. I am also wearing a robe. I am going to therapy. I'm taking care of myself. It's just like, it's basic necessities, but I'm also, grieving <laugh> like
Steve Wilson (30:01):
Self care with a dash of grieving on top.
Caitlin Harrison (30:03):
Yeah. And just like normalizing thinking about the nostalgia of summer and just like letting myself be nostalgic and reminiscent. So Gaba Ghoul, I'm a little spooky ghoul and a and I'm in a robe or a sheet over my head <laugh> and some protection. Yes. And so it's just like comforts, but then also like, let me just feel my feelings. That's "Gaba Ghoul Summer."
Steve Wilson (30:32):
I like this. I like that a lot. I like, I like the the radical permission to feel your feelings. Yes. As a part of that.
Caitlin Harrison (30:40):
Of course.
Steve Wilson (30:42):
Okay, my number three, it's a bit of a mouthful and we've already kind of touched on this, but it's really affecting me. It goes like this. It is, "There is a Sriracha Shortage. So Everything is Mild Summer," <laugh> <laugh>, you know? Yes. Wow. It's just, there's a lack of flavor of a certain kind for my palate this summer. And it's really bumming me out. Yeah. so just embracing that mild can be a part of it. Okay. just leaning into that.
Caitlin Harrison (31:13):
Okay.
Dani Marrufo (31:14):
Finding the spice to your life elsewhere when it comes.
Steve Wilson (31:18):
Oh, I like that there are other places to find spice.
Caitlin Harrison (31:20):
Also hearing a lot of acceptance. This is what it is. This is, there's a shortage.
Steve Wilson (31:25):
There is a shortage. Yeah. This is what it is. Okay. full disclosure, I did just go on to, on a vacation to another country. I went to Costa Rica. I found a bottle of Sriracha there and I brought it back. So I'm actually Okay. <Laugh>,
Caitlin Harrison (31:40):
Customs. <Laugh>. They'll get ya. <Laugh>.
Steve Wilson (31:43):
Alright. Round. Round Two.
Caitlin Harrison (31:44):
Round two.
Dani Marrufo (31:46):
Alright. Round, round two. I've got okay. Well I didn't rate them. Now I have to like rate them on a spot. Oh. okay. I think this is gonna be number by number two. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. It's a "AC Tree, and Smoothie Summer." Okay. So follow me here.
Caitlin Harrison (32:04):
Whoa. <laugh>
Dani Marrufo (32:05):
AC, air conditioning. Uhhuh <affirmative>
Caitlin Harrison (32:06):
Tree. Okay,
Dani Marrufo (32:07):
So we're gonna start there. Basically I don't have ac Uhhuh and I call my apartment "the hot house". It's just so hot. So I wish that I had like this tree of friends that do have ac Oh. That I can just like call one and then let me know who's available because I'm overheating. And then so it's AC tree and smoothie because my thank you is I'm running over there. I am like driving mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. I am in. I'm just like razor scootering. Yeah. Yeah. Razor scooting. It's really hot. I'm going to this friend's House. They said I can go over and I'm gonna bring them a smoothie to just like say thank you. Just thanks. I'm overheated and now I'm at your house. Here's a smoothie. I can relax now. Amazing. I'll be part of your AC tree.
Caitlin Harrison (32:50):
Amazing, I'll be part of your AC tree.
Steve Wilson (32:51):
I'll be a part of the AC tree as well. Come over. Bring a smoothie.
Caitlin Harrison (32:55):
I'm sorry. <Laugh>, but I love smoothies. Okay. I'll have to get your smoothie order then. Okay. Okay. I just made myself a kale pina colada smoothie. That was great. Coconut milk. Pineapple kale. I'm getting chunky from that. Honestly. No, it was blended real smoothie. It's giving,
Steve Wilson (33:14):
It's giving gritty. It's giving chlorophyll.
Caitlin Harrison (33:17):
Okay. So coming off from that, I feel like it's actually a good segue from my second one. Okay. Which is, and the lead up is the context is everybody at work has heard that I'm on a budget this summer. Okay. We're doing big things. Well, trying to Anyway. (Hot Girl budget.) Well, no, it is "A Hydrated and at Home Summer." So what do I have? I actually have a beautiful rental home with a C mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. I have a backyard. I have a dog. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Why am I going anywhere? You walk outside, it's $300. You know, like <laugh>,
Steve Wilson (33:55):
You walk out the door,
Caitlin Harrison (33:56):
I immediately, where it's Monopoly money, we're paying $200 to go home. So I'm at home, I am staying hydrated. I am drinking my water and I'm just chilling and I'm being part of your AC tree, you know, so I'll bring you a smoothie.
Steve Wilson (34:14):
These are really compatible because you have your friend come over who's part of your AC tree. Exactly. There's no need to go anywhere. 'cause You have friends, you have a place to hang out. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. You have good company. You can go bring me some.
Steve Wilson (34:25):
Some Mortadella.
Caitlin Harrison (34:28):
Some Mortadella, some Capicola. [00:34:30] Yes. You're Set.
Steve Wilson (34:31):
I like this. I like this a lot.
Caitlin Harrison (34:33):
Yeah. Okay. What's your second one?
Steve Wilson (34:36):
My second one is, I didn't like quite rank them, so I'm just gonna like pick on the fly. So in a no, similar to what you were thinking, like do I want to like think about gender in this? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, like hot girl summer. I know Megan was like, this is for everyone. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Those, there are those who have tried like hot boy summer and it just feels like "all lives"
Caitlin Harrison (34:58):
Yeah. Big vibes and
Steve Wilson (34:59):
We're not going there. Yeah. But, but I thought
Caitlin Harrison (35:04):
“Not all men.” Okay. Yeah.
Steve Wilson (35:05):
No, not that. So I just wanted to make some more space for those folks who don't want to exist on a spectrum or binary and have androgynous August. Oh,
Caitlin Harrison (35:20):
Okay.
Steve Wilson (35:20):
And just like all August, it's just like however you want to present yourself to the world, however you don't want to. You could be femme, you could be mask, could be neither of those. Just fully androgynous. Play with it. Make it, make it weird and enjoy it.
Caitlin Harrison (35:35):
I love that. Yeah.
Dani Marrufo (35:38):
I love that. I think that should be like, mandatory for <laugh>.
Caitlin Harrison (35:41):
Mandatory
Steve Wilson (35:41):
<Laugh>.
Dani Marrufo (35:42):
Just August in general, you know? Yes. Just for everybody. Exactly. Yes. Just do YOU the whole month and
Caitlin Harrison (35:49):
No judgment. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> loss,
Dani Marrufo (35:51):
Lots of encouragement.
Steve Wilson (35:53):
In my fantasy, it involves a lot of drapey clothes. Oh. Because, you know, there's, it's hot, it's sunny (Star Wars.) It's just like Star Wars robes,
Caitlin Harrison (36:03):
You know, like tunics,
Steve Wilson (36:04):
Like tunics, you know, like they're, you know,
Caitlin Harrison (36:06):
Are they a cult leader or are they just hot?
Steve Wilson (36:09):
Exactly. Yes.
Caitlin Harrison (36:10):
Why not <laugh>?
Steve Wilson (36:12):
So That's, that's and Androgynous August.
Caitlin Harrison (36:14):
I love that. I love that. Okay. Great. All right. Final rounds. Drum roll
Dani Marrufo (36:19):
In the name of something that's for everybody. Okay.
Caitlin Harrison (36:22):
Okay.
Dani Marrufo (36:24):
Chafe Cream Summer <laugh>.
Steve Wilson (36:25):
I'm sorry, what? <Laugh>
Caitlin Harrison (36:27):
No, I heard it.
Dani Marrufo (36:30):
Chafe Cream Summer is
Steve Wilson (36:34):
<Laugh>. Got it. Yes. For ev-er-yone.
Dani Marrufo (36:39):
Okay.
Caitlin Harrison (36:40):
Ev-Ery-One. Yes.
Dani Marrufo (36:41):
I was a Target the other day. Okay. And I'm in the sports section.
Caitlin Harrison (36:45):
Yeah. Androgynous August. Yes. I'm sorry. Sports aren't gendered. Keep going. I don't do sports,
Dani Marrufo (36:52):
So I'm in, I'm just shopping whatever. And then I see Chafe Cream and I was like, I come from the generation of people that, you know, you're wearing these shorts. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> Thighs are rubbing. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, you're in pain. There was like this life hack of like, deodorant.
Caitlin Harrison (37:09):
Oh yeah. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>,
Dani Marrufo (37:09):
You know, smooth it out. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> baby powder. Yeah. This is a, it looks like a deodorant stick. Have you seen it? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. It's just, you've seen it?! I was just like, I need, I need to spread the, I literally saw it and I was just like, this is my hot girl Summer thing is spreading the word about chafe cream.
Caitlin Harrison (37:26):
Wow.
Steve Wilson (37:26):
Spread the word and spread some chafe cream.
Caitlin Harrison (37:28):
I wish. Yes. We [00:37:30] had talked years ago. <Laugh>
Steve Wilson (37:32):
<Laugh>.
Caitlin Harrison (37:33):
This is, has been in the market. I'm sorry to take it away from you
Dani Marrufo (37:37):
For-Ever.
Caitlin Harrison (37:38):
For A long time. Yeah.
Dani Marrufo (37:40):
So
Caitlin Harrison (37:41):
Well I'm an athlete and that's why I know about it. And also I have thick thighs and that's why I know about it. Yeah. Me and Joe going to Italy, sweaty every morning, we are dumping on that <laugh>. Yes.
Dani Marrufo (37:55):
Yeah. Yes, yes. Normalize it. I don't have to be in pain anymore. No.
Caitlin Harrison (37:59):
Aw <laugh>.
Dani Marrufo (38:00):
Also maybe that would open, I was gonna say maybe it would open up for Androgynous August for maybe to wear a dress, you know, because that's The biggest thing.
Caitlin Harrison (38:10):
Ohhhh
Dani Marrufo (38:11):
Dresses. There's nothing down there.
Steve Wilson (38:13):
There's no fabric to help you.
Dani Marrufo (38:15):
Yeah. So I probably won't do that.
Caitlin Harrison (38:17):
Target also has anti chafing shorts. Like sweat wicking shorts that Oh yeah. I could give you a whole rundown. This podcast is not sponsored by Target or Cream or <laugh>. Yeah. Okay. So my number one, I can't segue it from yours. It's totally different <laugh>. So Okay. "Touch Grass and Get Ass Summer" <laugh>.
Steve Wilson (38:43):
I love it.
Caitlin Harrison (38:44):
Because we're getting, visualize... Yeah. We're going outside. We're touching grass. Okay. And then also gettin' Ass and depending on what you like, it could be touch grass, eat ass, but that felt a little controversial, but I still said it. So (no controversy.) No controversy. Great. I
Steve Wilson (39:04):
Like this a lot. I think there are plenty of natural connections to that with Chafe Cream Summer for
Caitlin Harrison (39:10):
<Laugh>. Well, well, <laugh>
Steve Wilson (39:14):
Careful where you're putting what where.
Caitlin Harrison (39:15):
Yeah. <laugh>. It's true. But it's just like, again, also what's free in my life. Yes. I can touch some grass and I can get some ass
Steve Wilson (39:25):
That is free. That's free.
Dani Marrufo (39:27):
Yeah. Love that also, for everybody.
Caitlin Harrison (39:30):
[00:39:30] For everyone. Yes. Yes. And if you're asexual, you get to get ass in a way that feels good for you. Exactly. Yeah.
Steve Wilson (39:38):
This feels really good because my top choice was Hot Mess Summer.
Caitlin Harrison (39:44):
Ooh.
Steve Wilson (39:45):
Just to Get ass. Do what you need to do. Let it all hang out. Be a mess if you need to, yeah. Allow it because it's too hot to care.
Caitlin Harrison (39:57):
That's so true. <Laugh>. I just,
Dani Marrufo (39:59):
I just got a visual [00:40:00] of like putting your last two together like Star Wars and Just like, I'm hot mess.
Caitlin Harrison (40:03):
<Laugh>
Steve Wilson (40:06):
I'm a hot mess with your lightsabers.
Caitlin Harrison (40:10):
No, it's giving you what's the, what's the big monster in Star Wars? The big like lump. Come on. Come on. Jaba the Hutt? <Laugh>
Steve Wilson (40:19):
You are taking it in a different direction than I intended.
Caitlin Harrison (40:21):
You're right. You're right. Gets to be yours.
Steve Wilson (40:25):
I'm thinking Hot mess in, in the same vein as touch grass, get ass.
Caitlin Harrison (40:29):
Okay. Okay.
Steve Wilson (40:30):
Just really to enjoy, enjoy being messy. Letting it, letting it be how it needs to be.
Caitlin Harrison (40:38):
Wonderful.
Dani Marrufo (40:38):
You're bringing that all the way back to Kindman & Co, Therapy for Being Human.
Steve Wilson (40:43):
Just be human. Go.
Caitlin Harrison (40:46):
Wow. What a beautiful ending. Messy
Steve Wilson (40:47):
It always comes Home. Messy humans. That's our podcast today. We talked about Megan Thee Stallion and her ideas about Hot Girl Summer. We kind of reimagined Hot Girl Summer. We played some games. We want to hear about what anyone listening might have to say about it. So find us
Caitlin & Dani (41:05):
Steve Wilson (41:09):
And leave us some comments about what you think Hot Girl Summer could also be. We wanna bring you to our Community Highlight on our way out.
Caitlin Harrison(41:20):
Yeah. Before we go back into session, we're gonna bring you to [The] ArtForm Studio. It's a hair salon and music space. They sell records. It's super cool. It's right around the corner from us. Shameless plug. I, Caitlin, get my hair cut there. So if you wanna see how good of a hairstylist they have check out my hair. But they are black and female owned. And we really love having them in the neighborhood. So highly recommend ArtForm Studio
Steve Wilson (41:49):
And we normally recommend a Instagram or social media account, but this week we wanna bring you to in continuing the Megan Thee stallion theme, her, a website that she created. That is Bad. Bitches Have Bad Days too Dot com <laugh>. Yes. And it's a great resource for all sorts of mental health. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> resources for BIPOC folks. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> women identified folks. And there are lots of really interesting resources to look at, accounts to follow hotlines that you can call, podcasts that you can listen to. So definitely go over there and check that out. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, because bad bitches do have bad days too. Yeah.
Caitlin Harrison (42:34):
They absolutely do. Well, thank you so much for listening. See you next time when we're Out of Session.
Steve Wilson is an Associate Marriage and Family Therapist, a queer man, and a feminist. He is especially drawn to working with adolescents and young adults embracing queerness. He deeply and personally understand the complexities of queer experience and want to help other queer individuals and partners, parents of queer and trans youth, and those practicing consensual non-monogamy (CNM) to build thriving, connected, & healing relationships. Fun facts are that Steve has been a teacher, tutor, publicist, recruiter, bookseller, cabinetmaker, and a zip-line tour guide!
Dani Marrufo is Latinx, lesbian woman who is passionate about supporting Latinx, BIPOC, and LGBTQIA+ folks. She is constantly navigating the intersections of my queer identity & religion/spirituality and very excited about helping poly and queer-identified partners to feel more secure in their relationships, communicate effectively and compassionately, and bridge any relevant cultural differences to have increased curiosity and enjoyment in their partnership.
Caitlin Harrison is an Associate Marriage and Family Therapist, social justice advocate, and a feminist. She works with individuals, intimate relationships, and families. Caitlin is a sex positive therapist with a special interest in the integration of sexuality and spirituality, women’s empowerment, and eradicating narratives of guilt and shame. She is passionate about working with couples because every partnership can be deepened, stretched, and more pleasure-forward. Caitlin feels at home with a cup of coffee in her hand, a bouquet of flowers nearby, and music at the ready to dance to.
GET HELP NOW
If you are interested in therapy with Kindman & Co. and would like to learn more about the services we have to help you, follow these quick & easy steps:
Schedule a free 20-minute phone consultation with our Care Coordinator.
Get matched with the therapist who’s right for you.
Start feeling more supported and fulfilled in your life and relationships!
THERAPY SERVICES AT KINDMAN & CO.
We are here for your diverse counseling needs. Our team of therapists provides lgbtqia+ affirmative therapy, couples therapy & premarital counseling, grief & loss counseling, group therapy, and more. We have specialists in trauma, women's issues, depression & anxiety, substance use, mindfulness & embodiment, and support for creatives. For therapists and practice owners, we also provide consultation and supervision services! We look forward to welcoming you for therapy in Highland Park and online.